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FINANCIAL CHRONICLE™ » FINANCIAL CHRONICLE™ » Sri Lankan scheme to help fight medical brain drain

Sri Lankan scheme to help fight medical brain drain

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gamaya


Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
@soileconomy wrote:We should encourage more more private medical colleges in sri Lanka.We need doctors .Patients are wasting time in ques(In private and governments hospitals).Doctors are considered as gods in SL becoz we dont have the required amount.But unfortunately they are the people(Doctors) who are opposed for private Medical Colleges bcoz they loose the business.That is why Some doctors refused to give practical training to those students(at private University) .They are not in National interest but Interested in their business.That is very pathetic.
If we take other countries situation is quite different.Patients are given utmost care , but here ,unfortunately doctors .
No one talks about billions of monies which goes to other countries for education.Even some south Asian Countries are far ahead of us in term of this issue.
No one is interested in National Issue , every one is interested in their private...........
Ultimately victims are patients

Cant agree with you more. Negligence is frequently happening and have anybody heard of a case where a medical staff found guilty. Very rare. May be they do some re-arrangments with patients records?

rijayasooriya


Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
@soileconomy wrote:We should encourage more more private medical colleges in sri Lanka.We need doctors .Patients are wasting time in ques(In private and governments hospitals).Doctors are considered as gods in SL becoz we dont have the required amount.But unfortunately they are the people(Doctors) who are opposed for private Medical Colleges bcoz they loose the business.That is why Some doctors refused to give practical training to those students(at private University) .They are not in National interest but Interested in their business.That is very pathetic.
If we take other countries situation is quite different.Patients are given utmost care , but here ,unfortunately doctors .
No one talks about billions of monies which goes to other countries for education.Even some south Asian Countries are far ahead of us in term of this issue.
No one is interested in National Issue , every one is interested in their private...........
Ultimately victims are patients

You can not open private medical colleges in every junctions.There are lot of requirenment to make a good doctor.First thing is very good clinical exposure.Medical students in government faculties have very good clinical exposure as there are attached hospitals. If there is private medical college there must be good hospital most importantantly with adequate number of corporative patients.

Otherthing is do u know the amount of a basis salary of a government doctor? Do u know how many hours a doctor work for day as overtime duty and how many hours thay are paid as overtime per day? It is the pathetic situation.

Of course there are a few doctors who consider this as a bussiness.But the most are doing very great service even for a penny salary.

pushpakumara


Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
@gamaya wrote:
@soileconomy wrote:We should encourage more more private medical colleges in sri Lanka.We need doctors .Patients are wasting time in ques(In private and governments hospitals).Doctors are considered as gods in SL becoz we dont have the required amount.But unfortunately they are the people(Doctors) who are opposed for private Medical Colleges bcoz they loose the business.That is why Some doctors refused to give practical training to those students(at private University) .They are not in National interest but Interested in their business.That is very pathetic.
If we take other countries situation is quite different.Patients are given utmost care , but here ,unfortunately doctors .
No one talks about billions of monies which goes to other countries for education.Even some south Asian Countries are far ahead of us in term of this issue.
No one is interested in National Issue , every one is interested in their private...........
Ultimately victims are patients

Cant agree with you more. Negligence is frequently happening and have anybody heard of a case where a medical staff found guilty. Very rare. May be they do some re-arrangments with patients records?

Whatever it is government should not let the qualtiy of people in this profession to drop because they deal with patience and lives. One minor mistake could cost a life of a person. So it is not the numbers of medical faculties it is the quality of the professionals who pass out from those institutions. So far our doctors have been doing excellent job but only highlights wrongs done by few professionals. It covers the good done by vast majority of these professionals. Government spends millions to make a doctor and it is upto the doctors to decide whether to practice in Sri Lanka or elsewhere after doing some service in Sri Lanka or any other alternative arrangment considering the free education they received from the state

Investor99


Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
@gamaya wrote:Doctors, Engineers and Academics are treated like dirt in SL. These kind of people needs motivation for self actualisation. Thats to be the best one can be, to do innovations, breakthrough to new ground.

Instead now they are forced to think how to make ends meet. How to build a house, how to finance childrens education, health needs etc. The way things are going, wonder of asia is just a dream.

Nowadays the few remaing professionals in the country are just puppets who have to dance to the tune of politic jokers. These jokers make the policy decisions, set out priorities for their personnal gain or as part of their power game.

Besides tourism, is their any strategic planning to start new industries, to do reverse engineering on import products and produce local substitutes atleast on certain niche products?

Almost all the mega construction products now come with a foreign loan. So they comes with the attached condition of the design built, or built component being awarded to a company of the funding country. What the foreign company does is have a joint venture, sub contract the project to local Design,Engineering,Construction companies at a cheap rate. So ultimately the foreign company takes away, more than a neat 50% as profits by just being an intermediary party; and the country pays the loan and interest for a long long time.
What if the local funds like EPF be mobilised to do the funding for these projects at a suitable interest rate? Surely that would be better than crappy investments like buying shares at peaks? and more beneficial for the country. Local Engineers, construction companies are more than capable of the design built part. They just need recognition, respect, which they are not getting at the moment.

From what I have heard for the loans granted from China, the Chinese companies should be granted the tender and raw materials should be bought from China some of the labour force should be recruited from China and the interest rate for these loans are a bit higher. Only think is that when China grants loans it does not and question about human right or economic policies like other world bodies.

Roboticfx


Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Today 60000 salary is not enough for a month. At least 80000 salary is wanted to fulfill all requirements.(even for a small family which has only 4-5members like my one)

pathfinder

pathfinder
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics

This is a very hot topic,I have seen some of our members put their ideas without knowing the depth of the situation.All post relly on the salary of a consultant,who has 11 years medical trainning. Please pay your attention to the below facts,

For MEDICAL OFFICER who has completed more than 5years trainning,
Basic -26500 LKR
OT per hour-210 LKR
Max no of hours per month 120
Max no of hours per day 4
A night oncall starts from 4.00pm-8.00am ====16hours
[ONLY ALLOW TO CLAIM FOR 4 HOURS PER DAY]



Don't think that doctors are doing a bussiness with patients,Don't under estimate doctors patiance as a timid thing,if all Drs resign from the government and do private practise they could earn above penny salary within 4 days [without on call nights]

For PMC issue,
PMC is not a bad thing,but there should be qualification requirments,supervision by gov.medical faculties etc... PMC should not like pastry shops where you can buy MEDICAL DEGREE as hot hot pastry!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


SO PLEASE THINK TWICE BEFORE POSTING THINGS

WildBear


Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
watch dog wrote:
This is a very hot topic,I have seen some of our members put their ideas without knowing the depth of the situation.All post relly on the salary of a consultant,who has 11 years medical trainning. Please pay your attention to the below facts,

For MEDICAL OFFICER who has completed more than 5years trainning,
Basic -26500 LKR
OT per hour-210 LKR
Max no of hours per month 120
Max no of hours per day 4
A night oncall starts from 4.00pm-8.00am ====16hours
[ONLY ALLOW TO CLAIM FOR 4 HOURS PER DAY]



Don't think that doctors are doing a bussiness with patients,Don't under estimate doctors patiance as a timid thing,if all Drs resign from the government and do private practise they could earn above penny salary within 4 days [without on call nights]

For PMC issue,
PMC is not a bad thing,but there should be qualification requirments,supervision by gov.medical faculties etc... PMC should not like pastry shops where you can buy MEDICAL DEGREE as hot hot pastry!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


SO PLEASE THINK TWICE BEFORE POSTING THINGS


It s pathetic to see the way the government treating the processionals even after winning the war.We need more and more professionals in Sri lanka now if we are to build up this country.

Sadly Sri Lankan politicians don't see any thing beyond the next election or next budget. we saw the Higher education minister SB and the government's response towards the university lectures who demanded for a very reasonable salary hike. SB called them as dogs,Fox etc.

Now we don't see any qualified Engineers,Accountants,Architects join the government sector.The biggest problem happen when the university lectors and the doctors start to leave the government sector. The whole system will collapse in a short period of time. Evil or Very Mad

Academic


Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
As far as quality is controlled no matter who offers the degree, either private or public. I believe in free system. If any of us have money and capability there should be opportunities to take any degree (including medical). What can we achieve through blocking others?

RockStock


Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
@Academic wrote:
As far as quality is controlled no matter who offers the degree, either private or public. I believe in free system. If any of us have money and capability there should be opportunities to take any degree (including medical). What can we achieve through blocking others?

It's always good to have private sector participation in education including medical education.I think we are a bit late in initiating it when compared progress of privatization of other sectors.

Quality of education would be of utmost value who ever it is given, state or private sector, and quality is especially important with regard to heath care including training of doctors,nurses etc. Because if quality is compromised in this sector you will not be alive to talk about it and criticize it. I think recent Private sector Medical college at Malabe opened even without a hospital. How can doctors be trained without patients?

After the open economy policy initiated in 1977 we saw private sector growth in many sectors.Some developments are really appreciable and some are horrible.

One example for good development is private banks. Those days people have to spend their entire day in state sector banks, and with emergence of private sector banks, story has changed completely,

One horrible example is Private buses and every one knows how horrible is it.

By seeing at developing condition, We can see the ongoing private medical college move towards the horrible category like the private buses, which will end up with catastrophic result.

However it's good to see the development of some quality private sector education institutes in the field of IT, Commerce,Accountancy etc
Eg: ,APIIT,IIT SLIIT(State but paid institute)etc.

sawdanjema


Equity Analytic
Equity Analytic
this is the wonder of asia!!!!!!!!!!!!

soileconomy

soileconomy
Vice President - Equity Analytics
Vice President - Equity Analytics
Please pay on attention on these factors.

Doctors prescribe medicine with commercial name instead of generic names(Bcoz they get a higher commission from those companies-It is said to over Rs 20 Bn for a year )
If we take qualification .How this district basis work.A pupil who has got heighest mark in an area like Monaragala (Lowest cut off mark for Medicine) will be equivalent to a colombo pupil who is in 350 of its rank in colombo district.
When I consult a doctor at a leading hospital which gives a foreign medical professional support , I had a chance to speak to her .Her qualification is lesser than of most of doctors Here.But we are paying more on them.No one questions that.(India produces a large number of doctors and send them around the world ....But We.......)
we spent over Rs 30 Bn for foreign education.No one talks about that.

If doctors are found with guilty with their profession they wont loose their jobs here (If they kill 100 patients )But other jobs here ...and other countries .
They earn more than 10-15 times of their basic salary from private practice.

we do have one doctor for 1300 patients where as the normal average should be 300.
Can we talk to doctor ask like .....why did u write commercial name of a medicine instead of generic name, do we get side effects on this medicine etc......NEXT DAY THEY WILL GO ON STRIKES PUTTING INNOCENT PATIENTS AT RISK ,....BUT THEY WILL DO PRIVATE PRACTICE DURING THE SAME PERIOD........

wiki


Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
@soileconomy wrote:Please pay on attention on these factors.

Doctors prescribe medicine with commercial name instead of generic names(Bcoz they get a higher commission from those companies-It is said to over Rs 20 Bn for a year )
If we take qualification .How this district basis work.A pupil who has got heighest mark in an area like Monaragala (Lowest cut off mark for Medicine) will be equivalent to a colombo pupil who is in 350 of its rank in colombo district.
When I consult a doctor at a leading hospital which gives a foreign medical professional support , I had a chance to speak to her .Her qualification is lesser than of most of doctors Here.But we are paying more on them.No one questions that.(India produces a large number of doctors and send them around the world ....But We.......)
we spent over Rs 30 Bn for foreign education.No one talks about that.

If doctors are found with guilty with their profession they wont loose their jobs here (If they kill 100 patients )But other jobs here ...and other countries .
They earn more than 10-15 times of their basic salary from private practice.

we do have one doctor for 1300 patients where as the normal average should be 300.
Can we talk to doctor ask like .....why did u write commercial name of a medicine instead of generic name, do we get side effects on this medicine etc......NEXT DAY THEY WILL GO ON STRIKES PUTTING INNOCENT PATIENTS AT RISK ,....BUT THEY WILL DO PRIVATE PRACTICE DURING THE SAME PERIOD........

Dear soileconomy..

There is lot of issues in the health care sector.

1. National health policy – there is no proper policy - just one A4 paged document
http://www.health.gov.lk/HealthPolicy.htm

2. There is no proper drug policy -
Develop and implement a National Drug Policy for the rational use and distribution of drugs.

This is what the National health policy is saying about the drug policy. Although there is a draft version it is not approved by the cabinet. http://www.who.int/medicines/areas/policy/NMDP_SriLanka.pdf

If there is a proper drug policy lot of malpractices can be minimised

Promotion of generic drugs rather than brand names for eg. Incentive can be given for generic prescriptions.

Can ensure quality drugs by limiting number of brands per generic (currently there is 50 odd branded versions of drugs available for generic paracetamol. For other drugs also the scenario is same. This warrant huge investment for post marketing surveillance, where ministry of health cannot afford it) and limit entering counterfeit drugs to market.

Etc...

3.How many pharmacies are there without a registered pharmacist?

4.How many people are treating patients without qualifications? (Without SLMC registration)

5. If you see the annual health bulletin, the latest one we have is 2007 (http://www.health.gov.lk/AnnualHealthBulletin.htm). Now we are heading to 2012. So there is lack of information (out dated information)

4. All the doctors working in the government sector are allowed to work in the private sector after duty hours (if they wish). Usually this is not allowed in other countries. But government is not interested in implementing proper GP system... why... Simply they cannot increase salary so they allowed working in both sectors. Do the public need that sort of system?? Will the quality of service can be increased by that sort of system..?? (Yes). Will it promote development of Medical field? (Yes), will it reduce health care delivery cost??

6. Most of the rural areas are underserved.
7 etc
8 etc
........


Regarding PMC at Malabe

There is no issue if we can maintain quality and standards to deliver quality output when establishing private medical faculty or any other faculty. And it should not destroy the National University system.

Other thing is cant we restructure the national university system to attract foreign students. If you consider Malabe faculty.. They need to pay for the Russian university so it save little amount of foreign exchange.

Issue here is it is difficult to believe what Higher education minister is saying.
He is Threatening every one earlier he threat to dissolve the Sri Lanka Medical Council (which is the governing body) if they not approved the Malabe Medical faculty.

http://english.readsrilanka.com/2011/09/12/s-b-threatnes-to-dissolve-the-medical-council/
http://www.lankatruth.com/index.php/news/local-news/9855-medical-council-will-be-dissolved-if-not-abided-by-the-government-

Latest one is he is threatening the Medical officers association..

I dont think the Government is doing exactly the right thing...












Last edited by wiki on Thu Sep 29, 2011 5:50 am; edited 1 time in total

pathfinder

pathfinder
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
@soileconomy wrote:Please pay on attention on these factors.

Doctors prescribe medicine with commercial name instead of generic names(Bcoz they get a higher commission from those companies-It is said to over Rs 20 Bn for a year )
If we take qualification .How this district basis work.A pupil who has got heighest mark in an area like Monaragala (Lowest cut off mark for Medicine) will be equivalent to a colombo pupil who is in 350 of its rank in colombo district.
When I consult a doctor at a leading hospital which gives a foreign medical professional support , I had a chance to speak to her .Her qualification is lesser than of most of doctors Here.But we are paying more on them.No one questions that.(India produces a large number of doctors and send them around the world ....But We.......)
we spent over Rs 30 Bn for foreign education.No one talks about that.

If doctors are found with guilty with their profession they wont loose their jobs here (If they kill 100 patients )But other jobs here ...and other countries .
They earn more than 10-15 times of their basic salary from private practice.

we do have one doctor for 1300 patients where as the normal average should be 300.
Can we talk to doctor ask like .....why did u write commercial name of a medicine instead of generic name, do we get side effects on this medicine etc......NEXT DAY THEY WILL GO ON STRIKES PUTTING INNOCENT PATIENTS AT RISK ,....BUT THEY WILL DO PRIVATE PRACTICE DURING THE SAME PERIOD........

"Doctors prescribe medicine with commercial name instead of generic names"

why?
There is no proper drug policy in Sri Lanka.If a doctor write a drug in a generic name patient has to buy it from a pharmacy where the pharmacist sells the drug which gives the highest profit to him.(no quality needs)It's like asking for a toilet soap from a grocery without mentioning the trade name where MUDALALI has freedom to decide.If the doctor knows the patient's affordability he could prescribe the best quality drug that patient could afford.

"we do have one doctor for 1300 patients where as the normal average should be 300.
Can we talk to doctor ask like .....why did u write commercial name of a medicine instead of generic name, do we get side effects on this medicine etc....."

The answer already there.Doctors do not have much time to talk with patients as said above.if a doctor had long chat with one person others has to go back with empty hands.

"NEXT DAY THEY WILL GO ON STRIKES PUTTING INNOCENT PATIENTS AT RISK ,....BUT THEY WILL DO PRIVATE PRACTICE DURING THE SAME PERIOD........"

In Sri lanka doctors has done only few strikes,At all those time EMERGENCY services not interrupted.NO SLMC registered doctors did private practice during that period.
May be some quacks did.

BY LOOKING AT YOUR 2 POSTS I THINK YOU HAVE A GREAT ANGER OR JEALOUSY WITH DOCTORS.

Gaja


Associate Director - Equity Analytics
Associate Director - Equity Analytics
Well friends i don't thing whether how many of you will agree with me or not, but the value for Academics and Professional coming down day by day.

Here is my general thought on this topic even though its little bit far away from the topic and not intended to hurt anybody

In this forum also we had a senior member, who is a professor but i am sure his salary is considerably low when compare with the some of the private tuition class teachers, is anybody things the duty of the professor is easy?

See the salary difference of an engineer who works for the State Engineering Corporation and the person who works at a leading construction company

Just thing about the fees of a leading lawyer with the lawyer attach with the AG Department

Compare the salary of a Chartered Accountant who works in a Government Organisation with the Chartered Accountant working in a Leading Company

these are just few which came to my mind, if you compare the list it will go on

Some talked about the Kick Backs, but kick backs involve in lots of several sectors

soileconomy

soileconomy
Vice President - Equity Analytics
Vice President - Equity Analytics
Thanks .Wiki for your link and other friends for their valuable ideas.

I was trying bring the issues facing by many patients facing in SL.

Lack of medical professionals here .AL students who gets even average higher marks are not allowed to enter medical college (Compare a student in Colombo district who gets marks and ranked as 400 in Colombo district and a student in Monaragala district who gets lesser lower marks than Colombo pupil and ranked as no 1 in Monaragala)
My dear friends Globally also like that ,An Indian student who get lesser qualification than our average student will enter medical college there and get a degree and work here .then why should we block our own people where as other countries it is the other way around.(apply this to Our Banking sector, Software development and other areas who the private sector is leading)
(In our History itself this mistake is there .Our kings fight to take the control of this land , even brothers in the same family fought against each other to get the throne But other countries British , France , Italy….what did they do ?
Like wise we all talk to block our own children where as the other nationals take the advantage .No one talks about more than Rs 50 spent on foreign Education.

“Navitas”, World famous Australian University sometimes back had a plan to come to Asia .Originally They selected Our Country .But our people said Education is going to be privitised and had several protest against this Understanding the clear negative outcome they gave up the idea without making a single statements knowing exactly their real value.After that they only Marked their presence at Malaysia instead of SL.I personally know people who did the protest against this Campus their children are getting their education at London.
Then who are the fools ?
Navitas campus attract more than 1000 students from SL in a year and a large no of students from Asia.

Now world is transforming towards technological sophistication from human brain minimizing human errors and more accurate data and diagnosis system.
That is why we have MRI , ultra sound Scanners , laser Diming technology..etc.
That is why many countries identifying the real ground situation ,are focusing more on technology development , experiments , and then and there average marks is very reasonable for medical entrance.
Like wise there are lot of things that can be discussed.
FINALLY .I WILL TELL LIKE THIS.
THERE ARE MORE THAN 100 UNIONS IN HEALTH CARE SECTOR WHO WANT TO INCREASE THEIR SALARIES , ALLOWANCES , AND OTHER BENEFITS, BUT THERE IS NOT A SINGLE ACTIVE ORGANIZATION FOR THE RIGHTS OF THE POOR PATIENTS .THEY WAIT , WAIT, WAIT AND DIE WITHOUT MAKING A FUSS AND MOST OF THE PEOPLE DO NOT UNDERSTAND THAT.
IF YOU HAVE LOOK AT THIS FORUM (IN THIS TOPIC) ITSELF IT IS CORRECTLY SHOWN ,VERY LITTLE IS TALKED ABOUT PATIENTS.
TOMORROW ALSO WE FIGHT , FIGHT ,AFFORDABLE PEOPLE GO TO PRIVATE HOSPITAL , POORs WIL DIE WITHOUT MAKING FUSS .
LET US PRAY…….THAT IS WHAT WE CAN DO…….AS POOR .

THANKS FRIENDS

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