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FINANCIAL CHRONICLE™ » DAILY CHRONICLE™ » Sri Lankan maid Rizana Nafeek beheaded in Saudi Arabia

Sri Lankan maid Rizana Nafeek beheaded in Saudi Arabia

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traderathome


Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
@D.G.Dayaratne wrote:Anger is part of their culture

As far as i know Kuran permit to kill who do not believe their Religion

Pl correct me if i am wrong
Point 1: Does the Quran instruct Muslims to kill Non-Muslims?
Significance of the definite article "Al" (i.e., "the")
A friend of mine once told me that the Quran instructs Muslims to kill all Infidels. I agreed with him that violent interpretations of the Quran exist and permeate many of our Islamic books. My friend then quoted the following 3 verses to prove his point.

Quran: {The infidels are your sworn enemies Sura 4:101}
Quran {Prophet, make war on the infidels Sura 66: 9}
Quran {Never be a helper to the disbelievers Sura 28:86}
I thanked my friend for making this point as well as indicating these verses, and then responded as follows:

Comments:
Clearly, the above verses can incite much animosity and subsequent violence vis-a-vis all non-Muslims. Accepted literally - and uncritically - these verses lend themselves to the unjust persecution of otherwise innocent people, whose only crime is being non-Muslim. However, a pivotal matter of linguistic importance is often overlooked: the significance and usage of the definite article, "al" (i.e., "the"), which precedes the various disparaging Arabic words - kafirun, mushrikun - that describe non-believers in the Quran and which are often translated as "non-believers," "infidels," "idolaters," or "polytheists." Furthermore, in Arabic, the definite article is physically attached to the word it describes.

See below:

Quran: {The infidels are your sworn enemies Sura 4:101}
Quran {Prophet, make war on the infidels Sura 66: 9
Quran {Never be a helper to the disbelievers Sura 28:86}
The exact Arabic expression in these verses - indeed, in every verse that talks of the non-believer - is "Al-Kaferrin" or "Al-la-dhina Kafaru." The use of "Al-" or "Al-la-dhina" limits the verse (and thus commandment) to 1) a specific time and place in historyand 2) a specific group of people who were obstacles to the establishment of Islam in its nascent phase. It is these two factors that caused these verses to be revealed. Had the intentions of the Quran been to extend the application of these verses in perpetuity, it would have used the expression "Man Kafar," rather than "Al-Kafereen" or "Al-La-dhina Kafaru". The former, "Man Kafar," literally means any one who does not believe in God; while the latter, "Al-Kafereen," - the infidels - denotes a specific group of people: they who fought Prophet Mohamed in the early stages of Islam.

Moreover, the overriding principle which must ultimately guide our understanding of these verses is the constant Quranic reminder that good Muslims do not initiate violence against others so long as the latter do not provoke hostilities.

Quran 2:190 Fight in the cause of God those who start fighting you, but do not transgress limits (or start the attack); for God loveth not transgressors.

Indeed, according to other verses, even if a Muslim deemed someone an infidel, according to the Quran, he is still obligated to:

1. Behave with courtesy :
Consider, for instance, the following verse, which is supposed to instruct Muslims as to how they should deal with non-Muslims in the midst of hostilities (such as war): 9:6 And if any of the Idolatries (who are fighting you) seeks thy protection, grant him protection, so that he might [be able to] hear the word of God [from thee]; and thereupon convey him to a place where he can feel secure:
If Muslims are to behave with such clemency and magnanimity vis-a-vis the infidel during times of war and conflict, how much more should be expected of their interactions with non-Muslims during times of peace?

2. Respect his freedom of choice to be a "Disbeliever" - as this is a right bestowed upon humanity by God:
Quran 18:29 proclaims, "The truth is from your Lord": it is the free will of any person to believe (in God) or to be an Infidel (Un believer).

3. Even if a Muslim should be convinced that someone is a non-believer, still he must accept that his fate is in the hands of God alone, since no one human can condemn another - this must be left to the judgment of God.
Quran 88:25-26 for behold, unto (ONLY) Us (means God) will be their return, Then it will be for (ONLY) Us to Judge (humans).
22:17 Those who believe (in the Qur'an), those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Sabians (can mean an ancient religion or people with no specific religion), Christians, Magians, and Polytheists,- God will judge between them on the Day of Judgment: for God (alone) is witness of all things.

The significance of the definite article ("al") or the substantive pronoun ("al-la dhina") which confines the aforementioned verses to a specific time and place - that is, the past, history - as well as against a specific people (i.e., the polytheists of the Arabian peninsula), is also key to understanding those many other verses that are often cited to incite violence against non-Muslims:
1- The infidels are your sworn enemies Sura 4:101
2- Make war on The infidels who dwell around you Sura 9:123
3- When you meet The Infidels in the battlefield, strike off their heads Sura 47:4
4- Mohamed is Alla's apostale. Those who follow him are ruthless to The infidels Sura 48:29
5- Prophet, make war on The infidels Sura 66: 9
6- Never be a helper to The disbelievers Sura 28:86
7- Kill The disbelievers wherever we find them (Sura 2:191)
8- 9:29 [And] fight against those (Al-La-Zina) who - despite having been vouchsafed revelation [aforetime] [40] -do not [truly] believe either in God or the Last Day, and do not consider forbidden that which God and His Apostle have forbidden, [41] and do not follow the religion of truth [which God has enjoined upon them] [42] till they [agree to] pay the exemption tax with a willing hand, after having been humbled [in war]. [43]
9- 47:4 Therefore, when you meet The infidels (unbelievers), [4] smite their necks until you overcome them fully, and then tighten their bonds; [5] but thereafter [set them free,] either by an act of grace or against ransom, so that the burden of war may be lifted: [6]

Kithsiri


Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Sadly I am unable to understand their logic.
If the Book also says "If you kill a man (human being), you killed the Mankind" then which one is right ? Embarassed
If modification to the creation is forbidden then why they go and get their foreskin removed ? Very Happy

Jiggysaurus


Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
@Kithsiri wrote:Sadly I am unable to understand their logic.
If the Book also says "If you kill a man (human being), you killed the Mankind" then which one is right ? Embarassed
If modification to the creation is forbidden then why they go and get their foreskin removed ? Very Happy



Last edited by Monster on Wed Jan 16, 2013 1:37 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Comment is removed since it's insulting Muslims and their prophet)

Chinwi


Associate Director - Equity Analytics
Associate Director - Equity Analytics
You cannot expect a slight kindness from these women. Even after a lifetime they will be the same with same hatred and vengeance mind-set.

They have been raised in completely different environment, socially and religiously which we cannot even imagine.

There is a big misunderstanding among both Sinhalese and Muslims in our country (those who have had no first hand Saudi experience) about Arabs and their resemblance with our local Muslim community.

To Arabs (except grown outside), you are just a paid slave from a poor tribe. What you believe is not their concern. For them, all are workers or slaves created by God for them. I cannot say they are bad. That is what they know. Most of those women have no idea about any human and/or human behavior outside their cult formation.

We cannot expect “logical thinking” or even “thinking” from 99% of them. Those terms are not in their Universe.

Jiggysaurus


Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Once again censorship by Monsters. This is how this cult hides the truth....why are true comments being censored on a Sri-Lankan website?

This Monster is turning this into a Saudi Equity Forum.

Monster

Monster
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
@Jiggysaurus wrote:Once again censorship by Monsters. This is how this cult hides the truth....why are true comments being censored on a Sri-Lankan website?

This Monster is turning this into a Saudi Equity Forum.
You have freedom to express your comment. But you have no authority to insult a religion or their prophet. Sri Lanka equity forum is not sorry.com Facebook page.

Admin/ Co-Admin: If you don't agree with me, please remove me from your moderator group.

Jiggysaurus

Jiggysaurus
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
The cult can censor people on this forum, since some cult members seem to have got moderatorships.

This cult poses a long term threat to the moderates living in Sri-Lanka. Continue the censorship on this forum (anyway it's an equity forum) but we will spread the truth about this cult.

If no action is taken to control the cult the same fate the befell Rizana will fall on our children and grand children.

Hanoifortune

Hanoifortune
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
@Jiggysaurus wrote:Once again censorship by Monsters. This is how this cult hides the truth....why are true comments being censored on a Sri-Lankan website?

This Monster is turning this into a Saudi Equity Forum.

your socalled cult is the leader of 1 .50 billion people now, he will be the leader of 50% of world population by 2022 and 90% by 2030.

QUOTE from a website
Very Important Announcement
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The End Times : As decoded by Numerical Analysis of the Quran, Hadith, Arabic Words, and Historical Events


The latest research of End Times Research Center indicates that, in-sha-Allah (if Allah is willing):

(a) The first phase of the End of Time will start (and the Imam Mahdi will appear) most likely in 2013.

(b) Jesus Christ (p) will come down from Heaven in 2022, but the World will not end in 2022.

The book includes in-depth analysis of specific dates (meaning we mention the day, month, and year) of important End of Time events

Jiggysaurus

Jiggysaurus
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
@Hanoifortune wrote:

your socalled cult is the leader of 1 .50 billion people now, he will be the leader of 50% of world population by 2022 and 90% by 2030.


When you breed like rabbits (even if your children end up in poverty) obviously you will get to 1.5 billion.

But what do you think will happen when the women of your cult get educated and find out that the founder of your cult was a slave owner with a child bride and someone who claimed that the majority of women will end up in hell (http://www.answering-islam.org/Women/in-hell.html)

This is why your cult shoot girls who try to promote education. Once the fruit ninjas of teh burka get educated it's game over for your cult.

Jiggysaurus

Jiggysaurus
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
@Chinwi wrote:Most of those women have no idea about any human and/or human behavior outside their cult formation.


Being careful Chinwi, the monster might censor you for calling his cult a cult.

Hanoifortune

Hanoifortune
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics

what can we do if you are impotance and can not have more children?
You are reading useless crap sites.pls read this to understand who moses, jesus and mohamed is.
http://www.why-christians-convert-to-islam.com/nice201.htm

and also watch on www.thedeenshow.com


@Jiggysaurus wrote:
@Hanoifortune wrote:

your socalled cult is the leader of 1 .50 billion people now, he will be the leader of 50% of world population by 2022 and 90% by 2030.


When you breed like rabbits (even if your children end up in poverty) obviously you will get to 1.5 billion.

But what do you think will happen when the women of your cult get educated and find out that the founder of your cult was a slave owner with a child bride and someone who claimed that the majority of women will end up in hell (http://www.answering-islam.org/Women/in-hell.html)

This is why your cult shoot girls who try to promote education. Once the fruit ninjas of teh burka get educated it's game over for your cult.

traderathome

traderathome
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Hanoi : Any News on Rizana's father ...........i heard from my wife that he passed away after hearing the news.....could be a rumour.....though ?



please check for me....
Thanks

Monster

Monster
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Even I heard the same news yesterday. As I feel, it could be just a rumour. Otherwise local media will highlight it as a breaking news.

@traderathome wrote:Hanoi : Any News on Rizana's father ...........i heard from my wife that he passed away after hearing the news.....could be a rumour.....though ?



please check for me....
Thanks

traderathome

traderathome
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Thanks Lokka.... Wink

traderathome

traderathome
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Matchang Jiggy,

Apith full uspet eke bang......

Tawa karadara karanna epa.....Please Crying or Very sad

TAH

Jiggysaurus

Jiggysaurus
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
@traderathome wrote:Matchang Jiggy,

Apith full uspet eke bang......

Tawa karadara karanna epa.....Please Crying or Very sad

TAH


Ithing umbe Mullah monsters la mawa censor karanawane, mullah censors la wa control karoth api karadara karanne na.

traderathome

traderathome
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Apita prashne punishment eke newei,

Rizana ta sadarana winishyak labunada kiyana eka pamanai.

We can not expect lots of reforms from them.....

May God guide them to establish transparent judicial system or review system ....

There is lots of grey area in the rulling.....

So please man lets hope these people change for better.

Personnaly i have no objection to punish the wrong doer....

But after its prooved beyond iota of doubt..

Thats all .....

TAH

glwking

glwking
Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
@traderathome wrote:Apita prashne punishment eke newei,

Rizana ta sadarana winishyak labunada kiyana eka pamanai.

We can not expect lots of reforms from them.....

May God guide them to establish transparent judicial system or review system ....

There is lots of grey area in the rulling.....

So please man lets hope these people change for better.

Personnaly i have no objection to punish the wrong doer....

But after its prooved beyond iota of doubt..

Thats all .....

TAH
I am also in the same view as of you. There should be a capital punishment to the culprits (to minimize the crime in the future) who have done the murders, rape and drug trafficking. But there should be a transparent judiciary system.

Slstock

Slstock
Director - Equity Analytics
Director - Equity Analytics
To ALL,

When we are dealing with religious issues and races , make sure to check your language so it does not sound offensive to followers. It can be sensitive issue and will naturally retaliate to defend their belief.
Also it might be wise to use word that does not sound demeaning. Ex : if you call a black american, a "ni****" they will find if more offensive and turn more aggressive .

To me Sharia Law and how this was handled by the Judicial system/ the Saudi woman are 2 separate things. The latter was the bigger culprit from what I understand.

Anyway I am glad there seems to be some broadminded and educated Muslim friends here.

I have/had the opportunity to associate and also instruct people from middle east . I have to say some of them came out as arrogant, aggressive and disrespectful while some others where calm, friendly and decent. I generally found people from UAE, Turkey, Kuwait to be more respectful and liberal than Saudis.

I think education , mindset, respect and exposure to other cultures is what makes the difference.

In any religion , more than what the concepts/books say it is the interpretation by the individuals that make the bigger difference.

Is killing good or bad? Take this killing for example. Some will say it is God wish and Sharia Law. Others will say, it is the judicial systems and the woman interpretations ( I drag the saudi woman as I heard the husband was okay to give pardon to Rizana when a minister offered to send the other child aborad for an illness).



Chinwi

Chinwi
Associate Director - Equity Analytics
Associate Director - Equity Analytics
@Jiggysaurus wrote:
@Chinwi wrote:Most of those women have no idea about any human and/or human behavior outside their cult formation.


Being careful Chinwi, the monster might censor you for calling his cult a cult.

I was talking about sub cultures inside the dessert. Although some of our people think they are bound together by the particular religion I don't see same from Arabs.

There are many sub cultures in Arab world. No one can apply them here; we will not allow. Similarly no point of arguing with our people for what is written in a book or what is happening elsewhere.

Sana


Senior Equity Analytic
Senior Equity Analytic
@pathfinder wrote:what ever the law,what ever the religeon,see this brutal act,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1B4ACG2Km34

No one has the right to take anothers life! I cant sleep or eat thinking of how she must have felt before dieing .Any human killing is wrong


inappropriate comment removed

Hanoifortune

Hanoifortune
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
@Sana wrote:
@pathfinder wrote:what ever the law,what ever the religeon,see this brutal act,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1B4ACG2Km34

No one has the right to take anothers life! I cant sleep or eat thinking of how she must have felt before dieing .Any human killing is wrong

-Christian believe only they go to heaven, Not Muslim, Buddhists, Hindu, Sikh and Jain
-Bro! Every religion teaches that good people who ever follow their religion strictly go to heaven.
-Do you follow your religion or Jesus strictly? But we follow Jesus than you do. Few examples for your understanding
1) Jesus had been circumcised when he was born. Who follows? Muslims!
2) Jesus bowed his head on the floor and prayed to his Lord. Who follows? Muslim!
3) Jesus cleansed himself before praying to his Lord. Who follows? Muslim!
4) Jesus said not to eat pork. Who follows? Muslim!
5) Jesus said not to drink alcohol. Who follows? Muslim!
6) Mary covered herself from head to toe. Who follows? Muslim!
7) Jesus has fast. Who follow? Muslim!
Do you follow any of these? But, We follow. As per Sharia law, If a Muslim do not accept Jesus he is not a Muslim.
Fyi, Name of Jesus has been mentioned in Quran over 25 times. There are few chapters about Mary and Jesus too. we are real followers of Jesus ,Do you think that real followers of Jesus are dogs?

glwking

glwking
Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
@Sana wrote:
@pathfinder wrote:what ever the law,what ever the religeon,see this brutal act,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1B4ACG2Km34

No one has the right to take anothers life! I cant sleep or eat thinking of how she must have felt before dieing .Any human killing is wrong
He is blaming to Muslims as dogs, but still no action been taken by moderators. Are moderators sleeping or purposely they are ignoring such comment.

Fresher


Moderator
Moderator
Public warning to Sana for use of inappropriate language even after the post by slstock.
PLEASE keep things clean.

Fresher


Moderator
Moderator
@glwking wrote:
@Sana wrote:
@pathfinder wrote:what ever the law,what ever the religeon,see this brutal act,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1B4ACG2Km34

No one has the right to take anothers life! I cant sleep or eat thinking of how she must have felt before dieing .Any human killing is wrong
He is blaming to Muslims as dogs, but still no action been taken by moderators. Are moderators sleeping or purposely they are ignoring such comment.

I would appreciate if you can do your part as a member and "Report" a post. Moderators are volunteers and do not screen each and every message. Please use this valuable feature in future to alert any active mods at the time.

Thank you.

(Thanks to Redbulls for the report)

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