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Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 9:40 am
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 11:55 am
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 12:05 pm
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 12:12 pm
They have not sold any thing, 59 million loss was due to "Gain/(loss) on fair-value-through-proft or
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 12:15 pm
@Alchemist: Thanks, I was on the verge of clarifying... Also, Rs 80.6 million shares were bought during the year, and mostly during 2012.@The Alchemist wrote:Incorrect. They actually bought Rs 80.5 Million worth of shares during Jan-Mar 2013 and not sold any. Check the cash flow statement.
The Rs 59 Mill loss on fair value through proft or loss financial assets was at 31st March Mark to Market and not relevent as of today.
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 12:23 pm
@Antonym wrote:@Alchemist: Thanks, I was on the verge of clarifying... Also, Rs 80.6 million shares were bought during the year, and mostly during 2012.@The Alchemist wrote:Incorrect. They actually bought Rs 80.5 Million worth of shares during Jan-Mar 2013 and not sold any. Check the cash flow statement.
The Rs 59 Mill loss on fair value through proft or loss financial assets was at 31st March Mark to Market and not relevent as of today.
Would you agree that the most important number in the financial statements is the NAPS = Rs 211.86 as on 31.03.2013?
With the increase in share prices since then, my estimate is that NAPS is approx Rs 255 now.
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 12:39 pm@Antonym, my estimate is around Rs 255/- to 260/- (considering only market value of CFI, not the real value). But still we have to wait till annual report to get the exact the value.@Antonym wrote:@Alchemist: Thanks, I was on the verge of clarifying... Also, Rs 80.6 million shares were bought during the year, and mostly during 2012.@The Alchemist wrote:Incorrect. They actually bought Rs 80.5 Million worth of shares during Jan-Mar 2013 and not sold any. Check the cash flow statement.
The Rs 59 Mill loss on fair value through proft or loss financial assets was at 31st March Mark to Market and not relevent as of today.
Would you agree that the most important number in the financial statements is the NAPS = Rs 211.86 as on 31.03.2013?
With the increase in share prices since then, my estimate is that NAPS is approx Rs 255 now.
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 12:40 pm@Antonym wrote:@Alchemist: Thanks, I was on the verge of clarifying... Also, Rs 80.6 million shares were bought during the year, and mostly during 2012.@The Alchemist wrote:Incorrect. They actually bought Rs 80.5 Million worth of shares during Jan-Mar 2013 and not sold any. Check the cash flow statement.
The Rs 59 Mill loss on fair value through proft or loss financial assets was at 31st March Mark to Market and not relevent as of today.
Would you agree that the most important number in the financial statements is the NAPS = Rs 211.86 as on 31.03.2013?
With the increase in share prices since then, my estimate is that NAPS is approx Rs 255 now.
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 12:46 pm
@The Alchemist wrote:@Antonym wrote:@Alchemist: Thanks, I was on the verge of clarifying... Also, Rs 80.6 million shares were bought during the year, and mostly during 2012.@The Alchemist wrote:Incorrect. They actually bought Rs 80.5 Million worth of shares during Jan-Mar 2013 and not sold any. Check the cash flow statement.
The Rs 59 Mill loss on fair value through proft or loss financial assets was at 31st March Mark to Market and not relevent as of today.
Would you agree that the most important number in the financial statements is the NAPS = Rs 211.86 as on 31.03.2013?
With the increase in share prices since then, my estimate is that NAPS is approx Rs 255 now.
@Antonym - Yes , if you go strictly by their Portfolio valuation, taking the CIT & CFI portfolios seperately, the current NAV of CIT is approx Rs 260. But their is a small problem with that approach. CIT owns approx 40 % of CFI shares, and since this is below the 51 % consolidation threshold, it does not consolidate them so it takes the CFI shares at market value, which as at 31st March could have been around Rs 100.
Now, Current NAV of CFI maybe Rs 240, so CIT'S CFI stake is potentially undervalued by further Rs 50-60 Per share, just due to this accounting treatment. Thus, I consider NAV of CIT to be between Rs 300-320.
This would have been the case had CIT owned 51 % instead of current 40 % of CFI (or if CFI Market Price = NAV)
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 12:53 pm@Jiggysaurus wrote:@The Alchemist wrote:@Antonym wrote:@Alchemist: Thanks, I was on the verge of clarifying... Also, Rs 80.6 million shares were bought during the year, and mostly during 2012.@The Alchemist wrote:Incorrect. They actually bought Rs 80.5 Million worth of shares during Jan-Mar 2013 and not sold any. Check the cash flow statement.
The Rs 59 Mill loss on fair value through proft or loss financial assets was at 31st March Mark to Market and not relevent as of today.
Would you agree that the most important number in the financial statements is the NAPS = Rs 211.86 as on 31.03.2013?
With the increase in share prices since then, my estimate is that NAPS is approx Rs 255 now.
@Antonym - Yes , if you go strictly by their Portfolio valuation, taking the CIT & CFI portfolios seperately, the current NAV of CIT is approx Rs 260. But their is a small problem with that approach. CIT owns approx 40 % of CFI shares, and since this is below the 51 % consolidation threshold, it does not consolidate them so it takes the CFI shares at market value, which as at 31st March could have been around Rs 100.
Now, Current NAV of CFI maybe Rs 240, so CIT'S CFI stake is potentially undervalued by further Rs 50-60 Per share, just due to this accounting treatment. Thus, I consider NAV of CIT to be between Rs 300-320.
This would have been the case had CIT owned 51 % instead of current 40 % of CFI (or if CFI Market Price = NAV)
In this case the high NAV is utterly useless to minority shareholders since these jokers will never sell their cross holdings. Similar case with LMF. Because they need to keep control of their holdings they will never sell so you should values these almirah case on a dividend yield basis (since that is all the shareholders ever get).
With all these high NAVs this management shamelessly begged for money from shareholders via rights issues. Fun the mentally you'd be mental to pay 300-320 for this (a 50% discount maybe more reasonable)
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 1:21 pm@Alchemist: I understand.@Jiggysaurus wrote:In this case the high NAV is utterly useless to minority shareholders since these jokers will never sell their cross holdings. Similar case with LMF. Because they need to keep control of their holdings they will never sell so you should values these almirah case on a dividend yield basis (since that is all the shareholders ever get).@The Alchemist wrote:
@Antonym - Yes, if you go strictly by their Portfolio valuation, taking the CIT & CFI portfolios seperately, the current NAV of CIT is approx Rs 260. But their is a small problem with that approach. CIT owns approx 40% of CFI shares, and since this is below the 51% consolidation threshold, it does not consolidate them so it takes the CFI shares at market value, which as at 31st March could have been around Rs 100.
Now, Current NAV of CFI maybe Rs 240, so CIT'S CFI stake is potentially undervalued by further Rs 50-60 Per share, just due to this accounting treatment. Thus, I consider NAV of CIT to be between Rs 300-320.
This would have been the case had CIT owned 51 % instead of current 40% of CFI (or if CFI Market Price = NAV)
With all these high NAVs this management shamelessly begged for money from shareholders via rights issues. Fun the mentally you'd be mental to pay 300-320 for this (a 50% discount maybe more reasonable)
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 1:22 pm@Jiggysaurus wrote:@The Alchemist wrote:@Antonym wrote:@Alchemist: Thanks, I was on the verge of clarifying... Also, Rs 80.6 million shares were bought during the year, and mostly during 2012.@The Alchemist wrote:Incorrect. They actually bought Rs 80.5 Million worth of shares during Jan-Mar 2013 and not sold any. Check the cash flow statement.
The Rs 59 Mill loss on fair value through proft or loss financial assets was at 31st March Mark to Market and not relevent as of today.
Would you agree that the most important number in the financial statements is the NAPS = Rs 211.86 as on 31.03.2013?
With the increase in share prices since then, my estimate is that NAPS is approx Rs 255 now.
@Antonym - Yes , if you go strictly by their Portfolio valuation, taking the CIT & CFI portfolios seperately, the current NAV of CIT is approx Rs 260. But their is a small problem with that approach. CIT owns approx 40 % of CFI shares, and since this is below the 51 % consolidation threshold, it does not consolidate them so it takes the CFI shares at market value, which as at 31st March could have been around Rs 100.
Now, Current NAV of CFI maybe Rs 240, so CIT'S CFI stake is potentially undervalued by further Rs 50-60 Per share, just due to this accounting treatment. Thus, I consider NAV of CIT to be between Rs 300-320.
This would have been the case had CIT owned 51 % instead of current 40 % of CFI (or if CFI Market Price = NAV)
In this case the high NAV is utterly useless to minority shareholders since these jokers will never sell their cross holdings. Similar case with LMF. Because they need to keep control of their holdings they will never sell so you should values these almirah case on a dividend yield basis (since that is all the shareholders ever get).
With all these high NAVs this management shamelessly begged for money from shareholders via rights issues. Fun the mentally you'd be mental to pay 300-320 for this (a 50% discount maybe more reasonable)
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 1:31 pm
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 1:35 pm 
Last edited by Bond on Fri May 31, 2013 1:40 pm; edited 1 time in total
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 1:38 pm Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 2:00 pm@Antonym wrote:
@Jiggysaurus: I have a different opinion...
(i) For investment trusts, NAV is a better basis of valuation than dividend yield. In the present context, I think a 25% discount would be appropriate.
(ii) A rights issue is a legitimate way for a company to fund its growth plans; there is nothing shameful or beggarly about it. It provides existing shareholders the opportunity to buy additional shares, generally at a discount to market.
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 2:40 pm@Chinwi wrote:@slstock / Alchemist,
What is the best way ? - Holding CFLB or going for CIT at current prices?
8% of my MT portfolio is CFLB.
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 2:50 pm Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 3:27 pm@The Alchemist wrote:@Chinwi wrote:@slstock / Alchemist,
What is the best way ? - Holding CFLB or going for CIT at current prices?
8% of my MT portfolio is CFLB.
A very good & tough question and the answer will ultimately depend on you and many external events , i.e, type of Investor Value vs Growth, Tenor- Short, Medium or Long, surprise value unlocks in CIT/CFI (Merger) or Huge Bonus / Split in EB Creasy etc etc.
To me, CFLB is one of the most undervalued most diversified mini conglomerates.
FY 2012/2013 is not going to be a great year for them for many reasons. without knowing their FY 2012/2013 results, i will stick my neck out (and at the risk of looking like a complete idiot) and estimate that FY 2013/2014 EPS will be close to Rs 10. then you can plug in a multiple depending on your risk tolerance / discount of other factors etc and arrive at a suitable price for you. I am estimating Rs 10 as all their sectors look well set to perform after drought / flood of 2012/2103 which affected their crop protection business, fertilizer, chemical and paints section. also motors was affected due to duty etc.
CFLB directly and through Colo, CIT & CFI owns approx 67 % or 1.7 Million shares of EB Creasy (issued 2.5 Mill shares). With Hemas buying MORI at Rs 2 Billion can we estimate what the value of EBC is ? i would guess at Rs 10-15 Billion. (Just few of Creasy subs + Darley Butler etc are much bigger than MORI). So you can calculate the value for CFLB with its EBC + COLO + Other stakes.
CIT / CFI are trading at approx 50 % of their NAV considering their holdings on CFLB @ Rs 39 and EBC @ Rs 1200. Due to factors mentioned above such as Earnings, Valuations, possible Splits etc, it is possible for CFLB & EBC to sometimes double in value in the next 12 months. If this happens, I will be very surprised if CIT/CFI prices also dont double, most importantly due to their illiquidity.
I would be tempted to re- allocate a 8 % portfolio exposure on CFLB as folls :
4 % CFI/CIT
3 % CFLB
1 % EB Creasy
Re: Interim Financial Statements 31-03-2013 - Colombo Investment Trust Fri May 31, 2013 3:33 pm@Bond wrote:Does EB Creasy still give loans to CLFB ?
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