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FINANCIAL CHRONICLE™ » FINANCIAL CHRONICLE™ » Manipulated or lack of funds ?

Manipulated or lack of funds ?

Go down  Message [Page 1 of 1]

1Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Manipulated or lack of funds ? Thu Dec 12, 2013 4:58 pm

nirowat


Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
CSE seems to be just floating sideways with no real interest. True the cooperate earnings have disappointed which has not helped.

Today a further 14 billion rupees were sucked in by debentures. very low turn over. not much buying or selling interest seen.
Feel those who are loosing patience are selling and those who are hoping is buying, both in small quantities.

Is this the time for real good long term investments to be made? If you look at CSE some investments during baron periods like this have given unbelievable gains and help build up stakes which are pretty handy.

Or is this a time to exit and all hell will break loose with significant earnings deterioration through impending financial crisis European style ?

Or am I completely out of sync and this just manipulation, which I am not very convinced about.

2Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Thu Dec 12, 2013 5:42 pm

econ

econ
Global Moderator
I think debentures have taken all money.

3Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Thu Dec 12, 2013 5:46 pm

Redbulls

Redbulls
Director - Equity Analytics
Director - Equity Analytics
Not only debentures but also Rights Issues.

4Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Thu Dec 12, 2013 5:56 pm

Hawk Eye

Hawk Eye
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
**No super Sep-Dec, and disappointed
**No big volumes trading
**Selling pressure starts building up
**Christmas in the corner, and all in holiday mood
**Month/Year end margin clearance
**Corporate earnings - not good
**December Results - Wait and see mode
** Big investors waiting to drag the market further down
**US-Fed to start tapering its monthly bond purchases in March 14 amidst stronger 1 st Qtr Growth

Can anyone give me a good reason for market to go up

5Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Thu Dec 12, 2013 6:24 pm

prabath


Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
@Hawk Eye wrote: **No super Sep-Dec, and disappointed
**No big volumes trading
**Selling pressure starts building up
**Christmas in the corner, and all in holiday mood
**Month/Year end margin clearance
**Corporate earnings - not good
**December Results - Wait and see mode
** Big investors waiting to drag the market further down
**US-Fed  to start tapering its monthly bond purchases in March 14 amidst stronger 1 st Qtr Growth

Can anyone give me a good reason for market to go up
Hawk Eye is not seeing the reality.Reasons for green will appear when market makes a real move within few weeks,and it will last.

6Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Thu Dec 12, 2013 7:30 pm

Hawk Eye

Hawk Eye
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
@prabath wrote:
@Hawk Eye wrote: **No super Sep-Dec, and disappointed
**No big volumes trading
**Selling pressure starts building up
**Christmas in the corner, and all in holiday mood
**Month/Year end margin clearance
**Corporate earnings - not good
**December Results - Wait and see mode
** Big investors waiting to drag the market further down
**US-Fed  to start tapering its monthly bond purchases in March 14 amidst stronger 1 st Qtr Growth

Can anyone give me a good reason for market to go up
Hawk Eye is not seeing the reality.Reasons for green will appear when market makes a real move within few weeks,and it will last.

want to know what is the reality. The real reason for the market to go up in December within next 3 weeks. A few weeks from now can be even January or February. By that time , yes, it will go up

7Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Thu Dec 12, 2013 7:40 pm

prabath


Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
@Hawk Eye wrote:
@prabath wrote:
@Hawk Eye wrote: **No super Sep-Dec, and disappointed
**No big volumes trading
**Selling pressure starts building up
**Christmas in the corner, and all in holiday mood
**Month/Year end margin clearance
**Corporate earnings - not good
**December Results - Wait and see mode
** Big investors waiting to drag the market further down
**US-Fed  to start tapering its monthly bond purchases in March 14 amidst stronger 1 st Qtr Growth

Can anyone give me a good reason for market to go up
Hawk Eye is not seeing the reality.Reasons for green will appear when market makes a real move within few weeks,and it will last.

want to know what is the reality. The real reason for the market to go up in December within next 3 weeks. A few weeks from now can be even January or February. By that time , yes, it will go up
Consider it January Very Happy Very Happy 
Even now share's are outperforming the market and index.52 week highs are also appearing.

8Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Thu Dec 12, 2013 10:57 pm

Leon


Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
@econ wrote:I think debentures have taken all money.

I doubt this. These are two different avenues. If people sold out their shares and enter in to debentures market should go down more than this. But now the market is sluggish only.
I didn't cash in my shares and apply for debentures. I don't know how many guys here did that. This business is addictive for sure.

9Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Fri Dec 13, 2013 8:44 am

smallville

smallville
Associate Director - Equity Analytics
Associate Director - Equity Analytics
Seeing the success of many debentures, particularity those were getting oversubscribed, why a company would not enter in to debentures? After all, its a better way of making money than rights or whatever.. Cuz this does not dilute the share value by adding more shares.
Only reputation of the issuer is the factor that makes it interesting.

Have you all considered the int rate of these? Can we do a comparison?

I.e BOC debentures of 4B (or was it 8B?) offered a 13% fixed rate for 5yrs. If interest rates drop, debentures are more attractive.

10Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Fri Dec 13, 2013 9:38 am

gamaya


Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
This business is addictive for sure. Smile Smile Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad 

11Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Fri Dec 13, 2013 2:18 pm

D.G.Dayaratne


Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Main reason is investors lost confidante during last two years

We have discuss this problem continuously during last period.

Now people prefer to invest their excess money in Debentures than in stock market

Authorities should understand their mistake and allow market forces to work.After 2009 authorities interfere market unnecessarily.
We have seen no one(even THE Central Bank Governor )can play the pool with  market forces

Now no purposes of talking about past.

All the participants of stock market must learn a lesson from past and take concentrated effort to correct it

Confidence building is not an easy task

It will take some time

All know this the best time to buy But No confidence due to past experience

To be very frank I also have same problem



Last edited by D.G.Dayaratne on Fri Dec 13, 2013 2:21 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : typing error)

12Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Fri Dec 13, 2013 2:53 pm

nirowat


Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
Did anyone notice what happened to VONE today?

Whole of last week and even start of today it was trading around 16 with no real interest from anyone. No significant buying or selling pressure.

Suddenly the counter was cleared to 17 in one go. My initial impression was an error. Since then a single order of 10000 was at 16.50 with the next buyer at 16.10.

If there was selling pressure this would have filled within half an hour given the recent selling trend but till day end it was not.

Thought a good example of manipulation, lack of interest both from buying and selling sides, which has been typical of CSE in the recent times.

13Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Fri Dec 13, 2013 7:22 pm

dhanurrox


Vice President - Equity Analytics
Vice President - Equity Analytics
@nirowat wrote:Did anyone notice what happened to VONE today?

Whole of last week and even start of today it was trading around 16 with no real interest from anyone. No significant buying or selling pressure.

Suddenly the counter was cleared to 17 in one go. My initial impression was an error. Since then a single order of 10000 was at 16.50 with the next buyer at 16.10.

If there was selling pressure this would have filled within half an hour given the recent selling trend but till day end it was not.

Thought a good example of manipulation, lack of interest both from buying and selling sides, which has been typical of CSE in the recent times.
There aren't sellers,who has shares to sell at these levels?Buyers will make a move soon to collect at more higher levels.

14Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Sat Dec 14, 2013 9:42 am

D.G.Dayaratne


Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
Senior Vice President - Equity Analytics
@D.G.Dayaratne wrote:Main reason is investors lost confidante during last two years

We have discuss this problem continuously during last period.

Now people prefer to invest their excess money in Debentures than in stock market

Authorities should understand their mistake and allow market forces to work.After 2009 authorities interfere market unnecessarily.
We have seen no one(even  THE Central Bank Governor )can play the pool with  market forces

Now no purposes of talking about past.

All the participants of stock market must learn a lesson from past and take concentrated effort to correct it

Confidence building is not an easy task

It will take some time

All know this the best time to buy But No confidence due to past experience

To be very frank I also have same problem


Do you agree with above

15Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Sat Dec 14, 2013 10:36 am

Chinwi

Chinwi
Associate Director - Equity Analytics
Associate Director - Equity Analytics
Issuing of so many debentures will destroy whole concept of the stock market.
 
Stock market provides capital at lower cost without any fixed costs like paying interest to the lenders.
 
Issuing of debentures at agreed high interest rates will take companies into more difficult positions in future. It is almost same like going for bank borrowings.
If interest rates go down, as the Govt. insisted, this will affect the bottom line of these companies if they can not redeem those debentures prematurely.
 

In addition, they are destroying the ground for low cost capital by sucking cash from the investors of the stock market. 

I feel the current trend of debentures is similar to providing huge margin trading facilities at the peak of the cycle without evaluating or studying future trends.

16Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Sat Dec 14, 2013 10:48 am

Chinwi

Chinwi
Associate Director - Equity Analytics
Associate Director - Equity Analytics
@D.G.Dayaratne wrote:
@D.G.Dayaratne wrote:Main reason is investors lost confidante during last two years

We have discuss this problem continuously during last period.

Now people prefer to invest their excess money in Debentures than in stock market

Authorities should understand their mistake and allow market forces to work.After 2009 authorities interfere market unnecessarily.
We have seen no one(even  THE Central Bank Governor )can play the pool with  market forces

Now no purposes of talking about past.

All the participants of stock market must learn a lesson from past and take concentrated effort to correct it

Confidence building is not an easy task

It will take some time

All know this the best time to buy But No confidence due to past experience

To be very frank I also have same problem


Do you agree with above

Yes.  Why not ?

I am also not buying and diverting any funds available to other ventures like planting some trees Smile
Somehow , I have already collected some stocks at current prices using part of my cash.

17Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Sat Dec 14, 2013 2:00 pm

nirowat


Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
Agree with DG as well. been continuously buying at very low quantities and have accumulated a small loss but feel confident will recover that soon.

I myself have put half my capital in debentures now and feel without knowing have become part of the problem in the CSE.

Am I worried about loosing out to manipulators, not really. I invest only in companies which will give a decent dividend on back of good growth hence a 5-10 % capital loss will be covered in a year or so in dividends.

18Manipulated or lack of funds ? Empty Re: Manipulated or lack of funds ? Fri Jan 10, 2014 9:11 pm

prabath


Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
@prabath wrote:
@Hawk Eye wrote:
@prabath wrote:
@Hawk Eye wrote: **No super Sep-Dec, and disappointed
**No big volumes trading
**Selling pressure starts building up
**Christmas in the corner, and all in holiday mood
**Month/Year end margin clearance
**Corporate earnings - not good
**December Results - Wait and see mode
** Big investors waiting to drag the market further down
**US-Fed  to start tapering its monthly bond purchases in March 14 amidst stronger 1 st Qtr Growth

Can anyone give me a good reason for market to go up
Hawk Eye is not seeing the reality.Reasons for green will appear when market makes a real move within few weeks,and it will last.

want to know what is the reality. The real reason for the market to go up in December within next 3 weeks. A few weeks from now can be even January or February. By that time , yes, it will go up
Consider it January Very Happy Very Happy 
Even now share's are outperforming the market and index.52 week highs are also appearing.
Done,how about your reasons now.Hiks.

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