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FINANCIAL CHRONICLE™ » FINANCIAL CHRONICLE™ »  "CIFL" IPO

"CIFL" IPO

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21 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Tue Jul 05, 2011 12:58 pm

alexd


Stock Analytic
Stock Analytic
With reference to

@mark wrote:why so hurry.....wait wait........
as i know still prospectus is pending,good that you interested in IPO's,but nowadays most are slops bcoz of unethical practices in PP....

@mark_fernando wrote:I got a recommendation about this company through a friend....every company has positives & negatives..awaiting for their prospectus..

and my earlier comment

@alexd wrote:Based on CIFL's Annual report for the year 2009/10 (http://www.cifl.lk/downloads/ann_rep.html - page 2) EPS was Rs. 0.79 and NAPS was Rs.13.07 these figures seem better than the previous year which was Rs 0.13 and Rs 14.92 respectively (obtained from the same report). Performance figures seems promising together with their offer price of 10/- per share. Awaiting the issue of their prospectus.

CIFL prospectus is available on the CSE website as of today (refer - www.cse.lk) - FYI

The EPS and NAPS for 9 months ending 31st Dec 2010 has been included in the prospectus and is Rs 0.99 and Rs 14.86 respectively. Would appreciate some expert comments on CIFL's IPO.

22 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Be aware-CIFL split before IPO Tue Jul 05, 2011 5:00 pm

PGCR


Equity Analytic
Equity Analytic
CIFL Audited financial statement shows EPS of 0.99 for the year ended 31st December 2010. As at 31st December 2010, there were only 19,739,424 shares outstanding as at that date. Subsequently CIFL Has done a Split (11 for 5 ) on 9th May 2011 & the new share capital represents 43,426,733. Then the EPS figure get diluted up to Rs 0.45.

Further, prospectus pages No 11 states that “If IPO fully subscribed, the offered Shares will amount to 47.95 % of the Issued Ordinary Shares of the Company subsequent to the Offering.”

Then, After IPO, No of shares issued will be 83,420,229. After IPO EPS (based on current audited accounts) will be only Rs 0.23. Which is at 43 X (times) P/E to its IPO price.

Over to you my friends…



Last edited by mark on Tue Jul 05, 2011 6:16 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : topic changed)

23 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Tue Jul 05, 2011 9:06 pm

ruwan49


Equity Analytic
Equity Analytic
Thanks PGCR,,Valuable Advice

24 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Wed Jul 06, 2011 9:45 pm

Chinwi


Associate Director - Equity Analytics
Associate Director - Equity Analytics
Thanks for alarming us.

Now, I want to know about the Shareholders list published in the prospectus.

There are 220 pre -IPO shareholders in Annexure F.

The number of shares each of them hold are very unusual.
396, 1558, 1041, 176, 5852 , 14555, ..... ???

Why is this. ?
I heard some badly managed finance companies converted their debt to shares and forcefully gave them to the depositors.

If any of our members know any of these shareholders please find out and let us know. The names and addresses are given in pages 138 to 141






25 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Thu Jul 07, 2011 2:27 am

Slstock


Director - Equity Analytics
Director - Equity Analytics
@PGCR wrote:CIFL Audited financial statement shows EPS of 0.99 for the year ended 31st December 2010. As at 31st December 2010, there were only 19,739,424 shares outstanding as at that date. Subsequently CIFL Has done a Split (11 for 5 ) on 9th May 2011 & the new share capital represents 43,426,733. Then the EPS figure get diluted up to Rs 0.45.

Further, prospectus pages No 11 states that “If IPO fully subscribed, the offered Shares will amount to 47.95 % of the Issued Ordinary Shares of the Company subsequent to the Offering.”

Then, After IPO, No of shares issued will be 83,420,229. After IPO EPS (based on current audited accounts) will be only Rs 0.23. Which is at 43 X (times) P/E to its IPO price.

Over to you my friends…


THanks for uncovering the hidden numbers. We need to be careful before buying with all these new companies getting listed one after the other.

26 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Thu Jul 07, 2011 7:53 am

wgsaman

wgsaman
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
thanx for your ideas

27 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Thu Jul 07, 2011 8:17 am

Chinwi

Chinwi
Associate Director - Equity Analytics
Associate Director - Equity Analytics
Sorry I posted this in other thread , re-post here.


As per the prospectus, there are 220 pre -IPO shareholders in Annexure F.

The number of shares each of them hold are very unusual.
396, 1558, 1041, 176, 5852 , 14555, ..... ???

Why is this. ?
I heard some badly managed finance companies converted their debt to shares and forcefully gave them to the depositors.

If any of our members know any of these shareholders please find out and let us know. The names and addresses are given in pages 138 to 141

28 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Thu Jul 07, 2011 3:16 pm

mark_fernando


Stock Trader
I think there is a mistake in the way PGCR has calculated PE
Ratio.According to my knowledge we have to take the IPO proceeds to
calculate forward PE.

Let me explain you how to derive PE based on my knowledge :-).There
are two types of PE ratios.Lets look at Trailing PE based on the past
data.First we should divide last year net profit by No of shares
issued before the IPO.In this case its (26,087,554 / 43,426,733)
=Rs.0.60.So the trailing PE is (10/0.60) =16.65x .The net profit
figure i have taken is for the Financial year ended 31st March 2011
out of which nine months are Audited.

To calculate future EPS we should search for their FY12 bottom line
and divide it by Post IPO no of shares issued (83,426,733).I think we
cannot use post IPO shares issued without considering the IPO proceeds
to the calculation.

Anyway I do not know much about the Company, want more time to go
through figures and prospectus.But i can clearly see some people
trying to mislead investors by putting wrong calculation and giving
wrong picture about the Company.After going through this calculation
I realized it.Dear investors pls do your calculations properly then
decide what to do!!!

29 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Thu Jul 07, 2011 7:55 pm

factFINDER

factFINDER
Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
@Chinwi wrote:Thanks for alarming us.

Now, I want to know about the Shareholders list published in the prospectus.

There are 220 pre -IPO shareholders in Annexure F.

The number of shares each of them hold are very unusual.
396, 1558, 1041, 176, 5852 , 14555, ..... ???

Why is this. ?
I heard some badly managed finance companies converted their debt to shares and forcefully gave them to the depositors.

If any of our members know any of these shareholders please find out and let us know. The names and addresses are given in pages 138 to 141


I guess these odd numbers came becouse of their share split of 5 in to 11 done in May 2011!!
e.g.
If there was 1000 shares prior to the splitting it becomes 2200.
If it was 100 > 220., ...440, 660, 880 ... 5500.. like wise.

Also ... what you said may be correct as odd number of shares has been issued far before the splitting (specially in November 2006). But even that year the company has made a profit and hardly assumed that they have forcefully converted debt/deposits in to shares.

But, shares issued in 2008/2009 are result of Bonus issue (page 49)


30 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Thu Jul 07, 2011 10:47 pm

MoneyLover

MoneyLover
Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
@alexd wrote:With reference to

@mark wrote:why so hurry.....wait wait........
as i know still prospectus is pending,good that you interested in IPO's,but nowadays most are slops bcoz of unethical practices in PP....

@mark_fernando wrote:I got a recommendation about this company through a friend....every company has positives & negatives..awaiting for their prospectus..

and my earlier comment

@alexd wrote:Based on CIFL's Annual report for the year 2009/10 (http://www.cifl.lk/downloads/ann_rep.html - page 2) EPS was Rs. 0.79 and NAPS was Rs.13.07 these figures seem better than the previous year which was Rs 0.13 and Rs 14.92 respectively (obtained from the same report). Performance figures seems promising together with their offer price of 10/- per share. Awaiting the issue of their prospectus.

CIFL prospectus is available on the CSE website as of today (refer - www.cse.lk) - FYI

The EPS and NAPS for 9 months ending 31st Dec 2010 has been included in the prospectus and is Rs 0.99 and Rs 14.86 respectively. Would appreciate some expert comments on CIFL's IPO.

Dear alexd,

Appriciate if you would show us the NAPS and EPS after 5 to 11 splitting done in May 2011?? Without showing the adjusted statistics your attempt to paint CIFL is incomplete and misleading .....

Before 5 to 11 splitting NAPS (as at 31/12/2010) was 14.86
After 5 to 11 splitting = 14.86 X 5 / 11 = NAPS only 6.75 and P/BV = 1.48

Before 5 to 11 splitting ESP (9 month up to 31/12/2010) is 0.99
After 5 to 11 splitting ESP?? .......


31 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Thu Jul 07, 2011 11:03 pm

ISURU

ISURU
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
Refer the following discussion also.

http://forum.srilankaequity.com/t6302-my-experience-in-cifl#42165

32 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Thu Jul 07, 2011 11:14 pm

ISURU

ISURU
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
Refer the following discussion also.

http://forum.srilankaequity.com/t6302-my-experience-in-cifl#42165

33 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Thu Jul 07, 2011 11:30 pm

rajithasamaranayake


Equity Analytic
Equity Analytic
mark_fernando how do we know Y12 profit? I cannot recall any company making losses in their forward projections? If these forward projections are done by independent to the company officials then there is some credibility

Did you recommend EXPO LANKA too based on their forward projections???

Friends, do not rely on forward projections made by own company officials. Immediate past year profit is a safer yardstick

34 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Fri Jul 08, 2011 1:46 am

alexd


Stock Analytic
Stock Analytic
@MoneyLover wrote:
@alexd wrote:With reference to

@mark wrote:why so hurry.....wait wait........
as i know still prospectus is pending,good that you interested in IPO's,but nowadays most are slops bcoz of unethical practices in PP....

@mark_fernando wrote:I got a recommendation about this company through a friend....every company has positives & negatives..awaiting for their prospectus..

and my earlier comment

@alexd wrote:Based on CIFL's Annual report for the year 2009/10 (http://www.cifl.lk/downloads/ann_rep.html - page 2) EPS was Rs. 0.79 and NAPS was Rs.13.07 these figures seem better than the previous year which was Rs 0.13 and Rs 14.92 respectively (obtained from the same report). Performance figures seems promising together with their offer price of 10/- per share. Awaiting the issue of their prospectus.

CIFL prospectus is available on the CSE website as of today (refer - www.cse.lk) - FYI

The EPS and NAPS for 9 months ending 31st Dec 2010 has been included in the prospectus and is Rs 0.99 and Rs 14.86 respectively. Would appreciate some expert comments on CIFL's IPO.

Dear alexd,

Appriciate if you would show us the NAPS and EPS after 5 to 11 splitting done in May 2011?? Without showing the adjusted statistics your attempt to paint CIFL is incomplete and misleading .....

Before 5 to 11 splitting NAPS (as at 31/12/2010) was 14.86
After 5 to 11 splitting = 14.86 X 5 / 11 = NAPS only 6.75 and P/BV = 1.48

Before 5 to 11 splitting ESP (9 month up to 31/12/2010) is 0.99
After 5 to 11 splitting ESP?? .......



Dear MoneyLover,

Many tks for you expert comments (which I did request for in my post).

I am indeed new to this and did miss the share split. When the EPS is calculated as advised by you,.... the EPS will be Rs 0.45 due to the split.

BTW, won’t the IPO funds of Rs 400 Million contribute or strengthen the EPS and NPV in some way in the current year/future? I glanced through the prospectus - but projections are not available to assess accordingly. Anyway..... trying to figure out if this will be a good 'short term' or 'long term investment'.

35 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Sat Jul 09, 2011 1:10 pm

wgsaman

wgsaman
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
What is your final decision about "CIFL"....apply or not...? Question

36 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Sat Jul 09, 2011 5:23 pm

factFINDER

factFINDER
Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
@wgsaman wrote:What is your final decision about "CIFL"....apply or not...? Question


I'm not going to apply CIFL ...

For me it is not attrective at all for both "Short-term" and "Long-term".

Diulted NAPS and P/Bv of 1.4, and PER Appox. 20 is expensive for a non-prominent RFC like CIFL.

Share offered at IPO is about 48% (post-IPO) and promoters equity will reduce to around 50%.

Most of last IPOs were from industry leaders;
Softlogic (Consumer Electricals/Health Care),
EXPO (logistics),
TJL (Fabric Mill of Brandex/PTJ - part of one of the biggest textile manufactures),
VOne (selected equity stakes of business leader DP - RCL (tiles), LB Finance-a leading RFC),
FLCH (a leading plantation holding + Hydopower Free Lanka, and backed by LOLC/BRWN/Perpitual)
HVA Foods - the largest value added/instant tea exporter
CIFL -- ??

We noticed that most of above IPO (from Industru leaders) also were not performed well in the market, So why should I invest in this high risk/less prominent CIFL?


Decleration - I just justified my decision for not subscribe CIFL IPO, but not a recommendation for otheres to follow.




37 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Wed Jul 13, 2011 7:44 pm

Fresher


Moderator
Moderator
I applied minimum qtys of Browns INV and VONE and some 1000 for TJ.
I did not apply for EXPO ans SHL due to certain reasons.
This is another IPO I will skip. These are my reasons

1) I do not want to sell my good shares to get money for this
2) I am not impressed with the prospectus - IMHO there are much better companies, even finance companies to invest in the secondary market.
3) How the allocation will be made itself is fishy - 10% to non retail. Does that mean giving better chance to employees and depositors or no confidence in big investors?

further another point to be notes is there is already 3.3% public shareholding according to the prospectus. There are many who have been holding 1-1000 shares since 2006 and 2008 which they got for 10/- (Im not sure if it was issued or debt conversion, someone pls clarify since I may have missed that)
So specially these people could be very eager to dispose them on the first day to get their money.

38 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Wed Jul 13, 2011 7:53 pm

Gaja


Associate Director - Equity Analytics
Associate Director - Equity Analytics
Your Money, Your Decision, Your Profit or Your Loss, so do your own analysis before making the final decision

39 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Thu Jul 14, 2011 10:27 am

maddu

maddu
Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
@Gaja wrote:Your Money, Your Decision, Your Profit or Your Loss, so do your own analysis before making the final decision

Absolutely Right Gaja...

Happy Trading...

40 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Thu Jul 14, 2011 10:40 am

StocksWatch


Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Assistant Vice President - Equity Analytics
Most of the comments on IPO’s are written here from traders’ point of view. (Not in this particular thread but in general). It may be because vast majority of retailers subscribe for IPO’s with the intention of selling on the first day of trading at the secondary market with some considerable gain. But an investor will have a completely different view.

If I am going to buy into a company (not only an IPO) for investment purpose, I will have two steps to go through.

The first step involves analyzing all available information and making the decision whether to invest in the company or not. This step will need the analyzing and processing of data related to following areas at minimum.

1. At least 3 years of past financial data about the company
2. Future business plans
3. The structure and constitution of current management
4. The future demand for the services and/or products of the company
5. The reputation of the company / customer satisfaction

If I make the decision to invest in a company, then there will be a second step to ascertain the price that I am willing to pay. There are different ways to ascertain this price and will largely depend on the type of business and risks involved.

Once you know the price you want to pay, then it is an easy decision irrespective of whether you are buying into an IPO or from secondary market. But a trader will not bother about any of the above or sometimes not even to bother about the name of the company as his decision will purely be based on technical indicators.

CIFL does not satisfy my requirements under step 1; so I decided not to invest. Any comment on CIFL IPO from trading point of view may be premature and gamble.

41 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Thu Jul 14, 2011 10:44 am

sajith15


Stock Trader
Thanks PGCR..

42 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Sat Jul 16, 2011 1:03 pm

dewminigamlath


Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
Why do major shareholders declare like this:

“The Major Shareholders of the Company Aspic Corporation (Private) Ltd and Mr. Mallawaarachchige Deepthi Perera who currently
holds 74.59% and 21.52% respectively of the Total Ordinary Voting Share Capital of the Company has voluntarily declared that they
will hold their shares which amounts to 38.8% and 11.2% respectively after the Initial Public Offer up to a period of one year from
the date of listing of the Ordinary Voting Shares on the Colombo Stock Exchange.”

http://www.cifl.lk/ipo/CIFL%20Prospectusnew.pdf (page 41)

43 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Sat Jul 16, 2011 4:41 pm

Fresher


Moderator
Moderator
@dewminigamlath wrote:Why do major shareholders declare like this:

“The Major Shareholders of the Company Aspic Corporation (Private) Ltd and Mr. Mallawaarachchige Deepthi Perera who currently
holds 74.59% and 21.52% respectively of the Total Ordinary Voting Share Capital of the Company has voluntarily declared that they
will hold their shares which amounts to 38.8% and 11.2% respectively after the Initial Public Offer up to a period of one year from
the date of listing of the Ordinary Voting Shares on the Colombo Stock Exchange.”

http://www.cifl.lk/ipo/CIFL%20Prospectusnew.pdf (page 41)

it is to 'assure' the potential IPO applicants that those shares will not be dumped in the market

44 "CIFL" IPO - Page 2 Empty Re: "CIFL" IPO Sat Jul 16, 2011 7:41 pm

JennyFunny


Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
Senior Manager - Equity Analytics
to make a quick buck i guess..

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