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FINANCIAL CHRONICLE™ » FINANCIAL CHRONICLE™ » Secondary market for Debentures..

Secondary market for Debentures..

Go down  Message [Page 1 of 1]

1Secondary market for Debentures.. Empty Secondary market for Debentures.. Sun May 26, 2013 1:18 pm

anu

anu
Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
Is anyone actively trading in debentures in secondary market. As we all mostly concentrate on equities, discussing on above would be very useful to have a balanced portfolio with guaranteed income..

2Secondary market for Debentures.. Empty Re: Secondary market for Debentures.. Sun May 26, 2013 1:40 pm

Slstock

Slstock
Director - Equity Analytics
Director - Equity Analytics
I have a small sum I put on a debenture 3-4 years ago and lodged it. Now I can't even track I own it. Once it lodged wonder why it can't show up in our portfolios even if they don't trade on CSE.

3Secondary market for Debentures.. Empty Re: Secondary market for Debentures.. Sun May 26, 2013 1:56 pm

anu

anu
Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
Earlier, equities and debt instruments were traded at the same board. I used to buy and sell. When interest rate in the market goes down debentures with rates above market rate will be trading at a high price, above the face value.
So debentures have two advantages in secondary market.

1. It gives a constant return.
2. It gives opportunity to get some capital gains when we correctly predict market movement of interest rates.

I hope now CSE has a separate platform for debt instruments. Knowledgeable members are welcome to share the information.

4Secondary market for Debentures.. Empty Re: Secondary market for Debentures.. Sun May 26, 2013 2:06 pm

Bond


Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
There is a vibrant OTC market. But you need 10m and a phone and fax Razz

5Secondary market for Debentures.. Empty Re: Secondary market for Debentures.. Sun May 26, 2013 2:11 pm

Slstock

Slstock
Director - Equity Analytics
Director - Equity Analytics
I am not knowledable about this.

But I read somewhere they were planning to list/trade debt at CSE.
This should be a good idea.

I saw our peers at Dhaka SE also lists Bonds.




@anu wrote:Earlier, equities and debt instruments were traded at the same board. I used to buy and sell. When interest rate in the market goes down debentures with rates above market rate will be trading at a high price, above the face value.
So debentures have two advantages in secondary market.

1. It gives a constant return.
2. It gives opportunity to get some capital gains when we correctly predict market movement of interest rates.

I hope now CSE has a separate platform for debt instruments. Knowledgeable members are welcome to share the information.

6Secondary market for Debentures.. Empty Re: Secondary market for Debentures.. Sun May 26, 2013 2:48 pm

anu

anu
Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
@Bond wrote:There is a vibrant OTC market. But you need 10m and a phone and fax Razz

Just went through the Debenture prospectus of MBSL. Minimum deposit - Rs.10,000. They also say -
"These Debentures will be listed on the Main Board of the CSE." Anyway, this was issued in 2011.

So someone who bought 100 debentures for Rs 100 each also should be able to trade it at CSE.

I think we should check on this further.

7Secondary market for Debentures.. Empty Re: Secondary market for Debentures.. Sun May 26, 2013 4:09 pm

udeni

udeni
Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
anu, there was a MBSL debenture issue in March 2013 to which I subscribed and was accepted. After that I got a separate statement of account for April 2013 from CDS crediting my units in the Debt Securities Index but I don't know whether debt securities are traded at CSE.

8Secondary market for Debentures.. Empty Re: Secondary market for Debentures.. Sun May 26, 2013 4:22 pm

sriranga

sriranga
Co-Admin
@ CSE we can buy and sell Debt.
http://www.cse.lk/debt_market.do


Daily report usually shows daily movements of Debt.
For example from the 20/05/2013 Daily Report.
Secondary market for Debentures.. 20052010

Secondary market for Debentures.. 20052011

We can place the order via Direct FN also.
List of Debts could be find in Direct FN.
Secondary market for Debentures.. Direct10

http://sharemarket-srilanka.blogspot.co.uk/

sriranga

sriranga
Co-Admin
Secondary market for Debentures.. Debt110
Secondary market for Debentures.. Debt210
Secondary market for Debentures.. Debt310
Secondary market for Debentures.. Debt410
Source: CSE Daily Report 23/05/2013

http://sharemarket-srilanka.blogspot.co.uk/

10Secondary market for Debentures.. Empty Re: Secondary market for Debentures.. Sun May 26, 2013 4:38 pm

anu

anu
Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
Thanks Sriranga. Udeni, hope Sriranga's post is helpful. I will again observe tomorrow.

If we can buy and sell debt instruments, important consideration may be liquidity. Whether market has sufficient liquidity to get in and out. Settlement looks like T+1 (spot) and T+2 (fwd). Probably brokers will not allow credit period. We may have to pre-pay or make immediate payment.

11Secondary market for Debentures.. Empty Re: Secondary market for Debentures.. Sun May 26, 2013 5:05 pm

Slstock

Slstock
Director - Equity Analytics
Director - Equity Analytics
Thanks Sri. Saw them listed on daily reports but did not think we can trade at CSE. Has anyone seen them appearing on ticker? Will need to check again.



@sriranga wrote:@ CSE we can buy and sell Debt.
http://www.cse.lk/debt_market.do


Daily report usually shows daily movements of Debt.
For example from the 20/05/2013 Daily Report.

Secondary market for Debentures.. 20052010

Secondary market for Debentures.. 20052011
We can place the order via Direct FN also.
List of Debts could be find in Direct FN.
Secondary market for Debentures.. Direct10

12Secondary market for Debentures.. Empty Re: Secondary market for Debentures.. Sun May 26, 2013 5:32 pm

Redbulls

Redbulls
Director - Equity Analytics
Director - Equity Analytics
Presently Debt market at CSE is very illiquid. Rarely find someone want to sell small quantities in the last 3 weeks. In future debt trading may be like equity trade in CSE.

13Secondary market for Debentures.. Empty Re: Secondary market for Debentures.. Sun May 26, 2013 8:39 pm

Fresher


Moderator
Moderator
All the new debentures are listed. Most of the old ones are too.
As others have pointed out, there is no liquidity in the debt market. Further not all brokers can trade freely I believe.
One broker asked a separate form in order lodge the debt in that account.

When a retailers wants to exit, you can probably get a bargain buy but I'm yet to see any.

14Secondary market for Debentures.. Empty Re: Secondary market for Debentures.. Mon May 27, 2013 9:26 am

yaka

yaka
Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
@slstock wrote:I have a small sum I put on a debenture 3-4 years ago and lodged it. Now I can't even track I own it. Once it lodged wonder why it can't show up in our portfolios even if they don't trade on CSE.
SLS as u said it cant be seen in the PF.thats a problem as whenever i want to sell i have to call my broker plus as per them even they cant put sell order to several days like shares.so that if i want to sell i have to call them each n everyday to remind.eventhough all these new debenture issues mentioned it's listed on mainboard it's very illiquied probebly coz people not much aware.

15Secondary market for Debentures.. Empty Re: Secondary market for Debentures.. Mon May 27, 2013 10:23 am

udeni

udeni
Manager - Equity Analytics
Manager - Equity Analytics
Thanks sriranga for the information. According to my broker we cannot see debenture trades appearing on ticker neither do they appear in our portfolio and we have to go through them if we want to trade them.

16Secondary market for Debentures.. Empty Re: Secondary market for Debentures.. Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:18 pm

Gaudente


Senior Equity Analytic
Senior Equity Analytic
@Bond wrote:There is a vibrant OTC market. But you need 10m and a phone and fax  Razz
I own all of those (although I would feel rather uncomfortable putting 10 millions on a single counter) , but where can I see prices ?

17Secondary market for Debentures.. Empty Re: Secondary market for Debentures.. Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:33 pm

Gaudente


Senior Equity Analytic
Senior Equity Analytic
@slstock wrote:I saw our peers at Dhaka SE also lists Bonds.
I am unable to see any reference in the DSE website. Could you link me a list of such bonds ?

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